Alright folks, welcome to what’s really exciting presentation, we’re really excited Rob and I about sharing with you some unusual email segmentation methods, using of all things surveys now realise that putting the word surveys in this presentation may have put some people off who otherwise should be using this method, and may have attracted some people who think we’re gonna do boring, old fashioned surveys. So that might have been a mistake. But we’re about to find out. Hopefully, we’re going to show you some brand new ways of using surveys, that even perhaps a format before never thought about before, I certainly am not doing it to this level. So let’s get things started. Rob.
Robert Temple 1:14
Yeah, so super chuffed to be here in case you haven’t come across us before. Hello, I’m Rob. He, wherever he is Kennedy, hello. Email Marketing heroes. So we are going to be sharing this stuff with you. As Kennedy said, we really want to touch on two massive problems that email marketers face really regardless of what they sell or who they’re selling it to. And those two big problems, I guess, are number one, actually turning subscribers who’ve subscribed for something that’s free into customers for the very first time. And then going beyond that is turning customers into repeat customers once we’ve bought something actually getting something else out of them. So let’s just look at each of those a little bit in turn, I guess.
Yeah. Okay. So the first thing we have, of course, is turning subscribers into first time customers, we all know, if we’re doing any kind of lead generation, any kind of opt in list building activity, that traffic is not getting cheaper, it’s getting more expensive, there is a limit to how much visual real estate, these all the platforms can sell there is Google, Facebook, Instagram, whatever. And that means it’s gonna get more expensive as time goes on. And list building is getting harder. And that’s because people are becoming jaded, people are becoming disenfranchised people are becoming blind as well, to all these different offers of free reports and white papers and cheat sheets and stuff. So basically, the whole landscape of list building is more competitive now. And that means we are in a place of like, a lot of companies are in a place where they are suffering from running out of cash to cash flow, the growth, the continued growth of that email marketing efforts. And the only solution to that really, is to be able to turn subscribers into customers faster. And it’s one of the hardest things we can all do is take someone who’s joined us for something for free, in exchange for their email address, so not completely free. But we have to then move them to say, Okay, do you have a credit card? And do you know how to use it. So that’s the first challenge we’ve got overcome.
Robert Temple 3:20
Yeah, one of the things we found is that, you know, every day that you wait, before you turn a subscriber into a customer get that first purchase out of them, the less likely they are to ever buy from you. It isn’t just about all you need seven points of contact to make a sale and any of that any of that it’s it’s, it’s not like let’s just keep kicking that can down the road until eventually it’s the right time for them to buy, there’s absolutely nothing stopping you accelerating that process of turning a subscriber into a customer quicker. And then if you acquire a customer, or that person becomes a customer, how do you take that person and turn them into a repeat customer, there’s the thing now, where we say that, you know, you’re never going to get rich from the first sale anymore. You know, if you are if you can cover your cost of acquisition, just by selling them the first thing, then you’re going to be in a really good place like that’s it, that’s a really solid foundation for a business. But you then need to be able to make sure you can take that customer and have a process for selling them something else. Because without that repeat repeat business, you really don’t have anything that’s scalable. So we know that chasing new business is really fun, that’s exciting, that’s sexy. Everyone’s talking about ways to go out and get new customers. Not enough people focus on the customers they’ve already got. Because let’s face it, if you acquire a customer, you’ve, you’ve now spent the money or put in the effort and time that it took, you’ve done the work to get that customer the first time which as we’ve just said, is not it’s not a walk in the park. So now the best thing you can possibly do is try and maximise that and say, Well, how do I take the customers we’ve already got and how do we increase their lifetime value? How do we sell them more stuff and help them out with most frankly, actually helped them out with more stuff, and do that in a profitable way as well. The
problem with doing that is when you’ve got an email list you’re basically playing a massive game of
Robert Temple 4:53
Guess who remember guess
Robert Temple 4:57
Remember, guess who my favourite
you Yeah, he’s one of my favourite games, did have a hat have a red hat? Did you wish Rob had a hat over his red hat? important questions like that. The thing is, if you will, no matter how you build your list, you really don’t know all the different things about the different permutations of the people, we know that we have to have some kind of micro understanding of every single person on the list, we need to ask questions such as, who are you? What do you want? What are your big pain points? And what are your goals? And if you don’t have answers to those questions, the problem you’ve got, as you’re treating everybody on your list, as if they’re the same kind of thing with the same important things. They’re all the same person, they all have the same pain points, they’re all in the same position. They’re all having the they’re all they’re all having the same challenges right now at the same time, and they’ve all got the same goals. Actually, that’s not true, as you know.
Robert Temple 5:57
Ideally, what we want to be able to do is to take people and segment them into little separate pots, depending on their answers to those questions. So you put them into different segments. Now we’ve all heard this been presenters and speakers already at this fabulous event, talking about the importance of segmentation. We all know we should be segmenting our lists. But then there’s a bunch of different ways to do it. What’s the most effective way to do it? And by what measure should we be segmenting people into these different pots? And so that’s what we want to talk about today. I mean, as we’ve already said, we have Rob and Kennedy, the brand of the email marketing heroes. I mean, let’s look at our business. I suppose as the email marketing heroes, we teach people how to do what we consider to be sort of smarter psychology driven email marketing, as a hypnotist, which is what I do, and Kennedy’s a mind reader to help people influence and sell more stuff to their email list, but without being really salesy. And that sounds fundamentally like quite a simple thing we help people do we help people to sell more stuff to their email list to do better email marketing. And in fact, it sounds pretty nice, right? Probably like whatever it is that you do, whatever your business is, and whoever you serve, and whatever you help them with. It’s probably a fairly niche thing. Or we’re also the host of the Email Marketing Show the podcast, which Sarah mentioned before in the comments with the catchiest theme tune in podcasts, just throw that in there. But despite the fact that what we do seems quite simple and straightforward. We realised that our list of subscribers our email list includes a whole bunch of different people. And we’ve got people with big lists of hundreds of 1000s of people. And we’ve got people with tiny lists of like 50 subscribers, and we’ve got people who’ve literally got no list at all, they’re literally just getting started. They are literally they’ve got an empty email marketing platform, and they’re waiting to get their very first subscriber. So there’s quite a big range there and the kind of people on our list, they’ve also got dif likewise, we’ve got different people problems.
Yep, sorry, yeah, they’ve got different problems. And one of the problems that they might have is they’re having problems getting clicks in their email, so no one’s clicking on their links, to go and check things out. Another problem that a lot of our people who come to us have, is not making sales from their emails. The third one might be that they’re having challenges building their list, because it’s too expensive, or they’re just not getting the opt in rates that they’re looking for. So people come to us, just us, just as email marketing, that’s subset of marketing. But they still have all these different challenges within just email marketing. So what we actually need to do is we need to help each of those different people in different ways, because they’re actually facing different problems, and they have different goals. But if we spoke to them all the same way, we’re gonna get high levels of disengagement, we’re gonna get high levels of, of people unsubscribe, we’re gonna have all those challenges, we literally cannot talk to them all the same way, offer them the same products or solutions or services or advice. Literally, we can’t sell them the same things, we have to talk to them based on what their solution what their challenge, right is right now.
Robert Temple 9:00
Now, if you look at your business, you can probably identify that there’s a bunch of different products and services that you sell. And there’s a bunch of different types of people that you sell them to. And your job is to sort of, or there’s a bunch of different types of people on your list. And what you really need to do is to solve that puzzle of lining up which people want which of your products or solutions. Or if you’re a business that really only sells one primary thing, the motivation and the reason the problem, the pain and the suffering that somebody has, that’s going to lead them to buy your product is wildly different. So one of the things that we sell as a software platform response suite, our survey platform, it’s why we became so obsessed with surveys, but we know that different people will want it for different things. Sure. We created it to make email marketing better and to be able to help email marketers. We’ve got some people who don’t do email marketing at all, and they’ve just found a use for it. They’ve realised why they need it for something different. So we need to talk to them differently to the people who need it for email marketing. Likewise, offline businesses and online businesses. We’re selling them the same thing but they need To come at it, we need to come at it from a different perspective. So either you’ve got a bunch of different types of people you sell to and a bunch of different products that they might want to buy, and you need to match that up. Or you’ve got one product, you’ve got a bunch of different people with different motivations and pains and objections and goals and stuff. And you need to be able to solve that puzzle and match them up. So that kind of makes sense.
Yeah, I think it doesn’t make sense. And I think what what then comes on to is, I mean, let’s, let’s just take an example of this is a client of ours called Emma. She is a social media strategist, and she has a social media agency. But within her audience, which sounds like Oh, she does social media, that’s what everyone on her list wants to hear about. Within that, that we she’s got entrepreneurs who want to get better at social media. So that’s what they’re looking for. She’s got other agencies who actually want her help to get more clients. And she’s also got people who do social media, within their job within a company. So like employees already within a business. The thing is, some of our clients want help with growing engagement. Others want help with building their own building their audience, and some of them want help with monetizing social. So what she’s got that is different once in the sort of white illustrations there. And then the hand drawn stuff, and then the photos with different types of people, she needs to speak to each of those people very, very differently.
Robert Temple 11:24
To make this worse, that actually becomes like a matrix. If you imagine it like a table where you’ve got the problems down the left hand side, and you’ve got the different categories of people across the top, you might have some entrepreneurs who want help with monetization, but you’ve got some people who work in a job and they want help with growing the audience. And then you’ve got all the different combinations of those things. So it isn’t just like, well, that means I’ve got three types of people in my audience, you’ve actually got those three, I don’t know, what is it three, I’m not a mathematician, three, three, the power three or three times three times three times, all it is but you’ve basically got loads and loads of them, different types of people, when you break it down across those different things. And the bigger your business is that the more this happens. So the question I guess is, could you see yourself doing a better job of serving your email subscribers? If you knew what each person wanted? I can’t see the chat box because I’ve got this thing open on full screen. But hopefully people will say, you know, yes, or whatever. But honestly, it could you do a better job of serving your subscribers, if when you log into your email marketing platform, you could just pull up a report of all the people who fall into a certain little pot. And likewise, if you could do that, could you then go on to make more sales? If you knew specifically about what stage of that process? Or what people’s pain points were, or any of that stuff for any of your particular subscribers? And again, I can’t see the chat box. But if anyone is typing, I’m convinced that for every business on Earth, the answer is yes. Because, yeah,
yeah, what we’re saying is that sent or marketing is dead. Right? You’re literally the Gone are the days where you can log in and send stuff to everybody and hope that it works. Yeah, okay, you’ll make some sales, you will make some, but you’ll also be really damaging, hurting and killing your engagement for all of the people who are not that relevant to that message. So we really need to have to do that. Rob, your favourite slide is next.
Robert Temple 13:14
Yeah, just quickly on that I really, really think that centre or marketing is the reason why open and click through rates in email marketing are generally lower than you would expect. So when so I don’t know if you’ve experienced this, if you’ve come across somebody who’s just started building their list, and they’re brand new to the whole thing. And let’s imagine they work really hard. They spend some money, they build a list of, I don’t know, 500 people, and then they send out an email. And they get, I don’t know, a 30% open rate. And they’re devastated that it’s not 95 because their expectation as a new person, was that their open rate would be so so so high, and then everyone flocks to them and goes No, no, no, you got 30% open rate. That’s, that’s, that’s good, like that crack crack on, you’ve done, you’ve done quite well there. And I think what we all done is we’ve also have normalised and accepted averages that actually are much lower than they couldn’t, should be. And the reason why that’s happened is that sent to all marketing, we’re sending emails, and we’re making sales and there are loads of great business owners making great money from doing email marketing. And because they’re making great money that overlooking the fact that they’re opening click through rates could be higher. And it’s all just because of Central marketing. For every every dollar that you make. There are hundreds of people who are getting messages they really don’t care about. And so that’s what we really need to fix. So
wrong cause is what is what is really good sales all about.
Robert Temple 14:33
It’s all about relevance. I’m just gonna let that sit there for a moment. This is the slide that represents relevance. Couldn’t find a picture for relevance, so I made this one.
Okay, making more sales is about relevance. And basically, the more irrelevant stuff that we accidentally send our subscribers, the less effective all of our emails gonna be. Every single bit of marketing is gonna be it’s not just email marketing. It’s affected by relevance, you want to put the most relevant message in front of everybody all the time, that sort of marketing 101 literally relevance will help you make more sales faster and increase the value of your subscribers in the long term too. So it’s not just about making more sales today, I haven’t better deliverability by getting better engagement from when you do email people, this is about going forward, you haven’t upset and annoyed and disengaged the people who are not relevant for that current offer that you’re running. But I know, I’m really harping this forward, we’re gonna give you the solutions on how to do this as well. Because basically, with relevance comes higher and better engagement and higher lifetime value of your customers.
Robert Temple 15:42
And you also get to sell more stuff, and your subscribers love you more as well. And relevance is everywhere. If you look at like Netflix, and all of the on demand TV type services, when you log into your Netflix account, and you see what’s there. So when if I log into my girlfriend’s Netflix account, what she has is all of the stuff it’s recommending is things like wildlife programmes, anything with David Attenborough in it or stuff about sharks, because she’s obsessed with sharks. Because if you look at mine, it’s all like gritty dramas about the CIA and all the stuff that’s going on, because that’s what I like. And so, if Netflix will show you the stuff that it thinks you’d like, based on its AI, and all of its stuff, and all that clever, clever stuff that Netflix is doing. And so relevance is super important. Likewise, they email you about stuff that’s coming up, they think is relevant to you, but they wouldn’t email me and Kennedy about the same stuff, because we have different tastes and what we’re watching. Likewise, Facebook ads, they only work when you get the targeting exactly right, get the targeting wrong, and everything goes to crap with your ads. In fact, Kennedy, your girlfriend, Emma came up with an interesting thing recently, right?
Yeah, I mean, we saw recently that you can turn off the targeting feature some level of targeting feature on Facebook. So she did that the other day. And she probably lasted about an hour of having seen totally irrelevant ads and switched their targeting tracking back on again, because she was sick of seeing generic, late 20s female generic targeting ads, when she’s not really into that stuff, she wants to see something she’s actually interested in. So we actually want that a targeted stuff, we want to send it, we actually want to receive it as well. And I think that all comes down to the fact that what we have to start doing is actually respecting people’s inboxes. More and treat email in the same way as we do any social platform. In one of the panel discussions just earlier on here. We’re talking about how, because of our phones, email is as ever present on in our lives, as being on any social network whatsoever. It’s just another thing we can tune into from those devices. So we should be treating it in a way that’s all about engagement, look at the algorithms for getting really good reach on LinkedIn, on Instagram, on Facebook, whatever your stuff reaches more people, and keeps more people on the on those platforms, which is what they want, if it’s much more engaging. And that the only way to do that is through higher relevance. That’s why you’ve got relevant scores and stuff if you run if you run ads. So How the hell do we do it? Well, let’s let’s take a look, Rob, at how email marketing sort of traditionally has worked in the past.
Robert Temple 18:25
Yeah, and this is how most people are still doing it. This is fundamentally the email marketing model, somebody opts into your newsletter, they register for a webinar, they buy a product from you, somehow, their permission based email, they give you their email address and permission to email them, etc. And they come into your business, and then they basically will go through a sequence of emails. So let’s go back to Emma, our social media client we mentioned earlier. So she might have, let’s imagine a sequence of emails that sell her course, or her training about how to create great content for social media, right? So people are going through that sequence of emails. And that could be like an automated follow up sequence. It could be that that just happens to be what she’s broadcasting this week, and you’ve joined my joined her list this week. So you’re getting emails about that. And we’ve put three there to represent it. But let’s bear in mind that any particular campaign to sell a particular product or service could actually be 359 1215 100 emails long. So let’s just say it was three optimistically. And then you get to the end of that, and let’s imagine you haven’t bought anything yet, because that’s not really you know, you’re pretty good at content creation, for example, Kennedy’s excellent at creating social content. That might be his bag. He’s okay with that. That’s totally fine. Next, okay, now it’s time to move on to the next product. So maybe this is all about scheduling your social media, maybe she’s got a software platform for for scheduling, social, you know, whatever it’s going to be, she’s selling that now. And again, it’s 346 12 1500, whatever emails, and you get to the end of that, and maybe some people buy it, and most people don’t, because that’s life. And then moving on to the next thing and the next sequences are okay, how do you get a bigger audience on social media? Maybe that’s going to be relevant to you? How do I get a bigger audience so she’s mailing that now for a little while again, could be follow up sequence that as a pre determined It could be broadcasts happening live. And then let’s imagine the last one in our little example, obviously, this would go on forever, would be how to monetize social media right. Now the problem is, if somebody comes into your business today to Emma’s business today, and what they’re actually looking for is help with monetizing social. That means that in this example, they now have to wait through nine emails. And again, that’s a relatively conservative example, to get to the thing they’re actually interested in. Which means that there’s a big chance they’re going to unsubscribe somewhere along the way, because until that point, they’re getting a bunch of stuff that is maybe interesting, but potentially irrelevant and very mind relevant and interesting and not hand in hand. You can 100% have stuff that is very interesting, but totally irrelevant. And relevance totally Trump’s interest. When it comes to paying attention to stuff. I can be interested in stuff all day long. But if it doesn’t help me serve my agenda, right now, I’m going to switch off from that thing quite quickly. Because we have limited, we don’t have limited attention spans, we have limited attention spans and stuff that’s not relevant. Like, I’ll watch stuff that I’m enjoying, and I want to watch all day long. So I have an attention span, as long as I need it to be for stuff that’s interesting. And serving me, right. So let’s not just take this blanket statement that the world has a short attention span, the world has an infinite attention span for stuff that’s actually serving them in any given moment. And so if you’re sending them a load of stuff that might be interesting, but doesn’t serve them because it’s not relevant, then people are going to switch off, they’re going to unsubscribe, or do you know what, they might not even unsubscribe, they might just disengage, which is even worse, because there’s people who are far cleverer than us can tell you in this in this event, if people are on your list, and they’re receiving your emails, but they’re not opening them, that tells all sorts of things that sends all sorts of messages back to your email service provider in terms of obituary back to your email marketing platform, in terms of in terms of the fact that you’re sending stuff to people, that’s not interesting, charging, delivery, etc. So this is a problem. And bearing in mind, if this was if these were live broadcasts, not automated follow up sequences, and somebody joined your list a few days after you are marketing, the thing that they’re most interested in, you’ve now missed them until the next time you happen to be mailing that thing, which could be months from now or like a year from now. So this is so so so okay, but this is sort of traditionally what we call what we call horizontal email marketing. And this is how it’s currently working.
Right? Right. So I’ll show you instead is a thing called vertical email marketing. What if instead, when someone opts in our buys, if they are interested in content creation, the first sequence they go through is all about your content creation programme? What if they liked social scheduling as the thing as their biggest challenge right now, and you told them all about your amazing social scheduling tool. And if they’re interested in growing your audience, you take them straight to that audit straight to that sequence. And the same for monetizing social. So they’ve not had to sift through and put up with a bunch of irrelevant stuff. Instead, they’ve gone straight into hearing about things that actually solve their problem. Remember, one thing that a lot of really big email marketers who are doing eecom, doing really massive campaigns, when we work with them, when we talk to them, they often forget that the reason someone’s joined your mailing list is to solve a problem. And that is it. So if you are, if you have a store, which sells designer clothes, the sort, the problem you’re solving is, I need to look great, all of these events that I’m going to, that’s the problem I’m solving. In this case with me as a social media company, it’s I need to grow my business with social media. But I’m really bad at growing my audience, we are all solving a problem. And the sooner we can get to a point, the quicker we can get somebody to a point where we’re solving that problem, the more they’re going to like us, and the quicker they’re going to pay us for a solution, which allows us to cash flow and continue that relationship in a highly relevant situation. So all of that turns into sales, dollar bills, piles of cash much, much quicker.
Robert Temple 24:02
You can make bank super fast. So the idea here as one of our clients has. And so the idea here is that you really want to do what we said before, which is shorten the time that it takes you from somebody coming into your business to becoming a customer for the first time. Or if they came into your business by being a customer, get them to that point of being a repeat customer really, really quickly as well. And you can definitely make more sales when you do it this way, because we’ve just seen it time and time again. So let’s look at the campaign that actually does this for you. Because we don’t just want to fill you with the theory for 15 minutes. Nobody likes
excite. Yeah. And like tease you like that person, the bio leads you on and goes, No thanks. We want to be that guy.
Robert Temple 24:39
So this is what we’ve been doing differently for about probably about eight years within our business. Having done it having done email marketing for 14 or 15 years each. for about the last eight years. We’ve both in our separate businesses because we got a few have been doing this and getting tremendous results. It basically begins with four emails, and one survey, right. That’s what you need. For emails, and one survey and the reason we want to serve it is that the quickest way to find out what your subscribers want is actually just to ask them without any sort of clever technology of trying to figure it out, you can literally just ask them the question, and people love you for it if you do it in the way that we’re going to describe, but I know what you thinking, right?
surveys are not very good. Very good. People think they’re a bit poop, they don’t get any engagement. They’ve got such low completion rate. No one wants to complete a survey. Will you know, it’s already hard enough to get people to engage in my emails? I don’t mind doing a bloody survey. Okay. Well, let us tell you that this is not your mama’s all surveys, okay.
Robert Temple 25:46
Now, we’re going to tell you how to make surveys that are driven for conversion. They’re exciting and interesting for your subscribers and relevant to your subscribers, which means that you get high completion rates, it means that they actually serve a purpose. And people actually like filling them out. So what we need to very quickly differentiate between is when you go and stay in a hotel, or you attend a conference, and then you get some long winded, horrendous survey, that’s like 29 questions on a page 300 pages long. And it’s full of long essay, answer questions. We’re not talking about that stuff at all, as you’ll see as we go through this, through this thing. And it’s really easy, I think, in in this world that we live in to get wrapped up and excited by the latest technology. So for example, when Facebook pages were first a thing, how excited did the world get by the fact that you could have a fan page that had more fans on it than the 5000 friend limit that you can have on Facebook? And then suddenly that became problematic? And everybody jumped ship and moved over and said, Okay, well now I need it for the Facebook group full of people. Okay, great. Then Instagram came about and that became the trendy place to be. And then when some people started to struggle getting results with email, because email got more difficult because Martin has brick everything, don’t you know, suddenly, everybody jumped over to chat bots now will now chat bots are becoming a bit more restricted if you look at so for example, their Facebook Messenger driven chat bots that’s becoming more complicated now with their new rules and guidelines and stuff. Okay, great. Now now currently, the world is trying to suss out how do we do this all with WhatsApp messaging, and that’s really in its infancy, but coming on quite fast. And the problem is, people are constantly chasing this new technology that keeps getting pushed away. There’s a couple of bits of technology that have never become outdated, and they are surveys and email marketing. And that’s why we love them both. And they work really well hand in hand together if you follow this really simple little set of principles. So this comes in really two phases. And phase number one is a campaign that you can run to your entire list right now as a broadcast over, say, the next four days. And then the second phase of it is something that you could build in as like an automated sequence that would go to every new subscriber. So in other words, what we’re what we’re going to show you, you can take and run as a broadcast to everybody in your list now to get it done. And then take it once you’re happy with it, and stick it as an automated follow up sequence that every new subscriber gets to see.
Right. So it all begins with I mean, it looks looks like this, literally, the first thing you need to do is send out a series of emails that drive people to take the survey, the big thing that we see that to increase the number of people who complete your surveys is people don’t remind people to take the survey, you would never do that. You would never send one email to a product sale or promotion or anything like that and expected to sell the maximum amount, we know that email number one, and email number three, have the most significant impact on any campaign that we run for any client or for ourselves. So we’re gonna literally send out four emails one day apart. And of course, what we are going to do is we’re going to make sure we exclude people who take the survey from getting reminders. I did receive an email just a few weeks ago, which started off with if you didn’t take yesterday’s survey, could you go and take it now? Well, guess what I did take yesterday’s survey. I’m a hyper responder and the most engaged person you’ve got, and now you’re annoying me. So we’ve got to make sure that we have a way of integrating obviously, response to me is our survey platform, which does integrate with email marketing platforms or CRMs. So but you want to choose a survey platform that does that integrates with CRM and email marketing platforms, so that you can exclude the people who have taken the survey from getting those reminders. So one day apart and just stack up thing literally just keep them short. Keep them like I say one day apart, don’t go mad, don’t leave too long about it. Just because you want to get getting go and and literally make sure that you’re driving people towards taking that survey and and tell them that it’s going to be short.
Robert Temple 29:42
And if you come into if you were to subscribe to our list, which is quite hard to do right now for people who do email marketing, the only way you can currently get into all this I think is by buying something but imagine imagine you were to become a customer of ours and now you’re in our list. One of the first things you will get is this survey. This is actually this is a screenshot. I took it this morning and put it into the most up to date. Well, this is actually a screenshot of our actual survey that we send out to everybody who comes into our list for the very first time, basically about a day after they’ve subscribed. And so let’s take
a look at what the email looks like that we’re actually going to send to those people. Because it is simple, right? It literally says, I’ll read it as I’m doing to rob. Hi, Rob, I’m working on something, I want to know how I can help you best. So I put this, I’ll put together this quick survey to find out. Now all the onus on getting them to complete the survey is on this is for you. This is not for me to find out, if I can pat myself on the back or show my manager or put the chart on a forum somewhere, or to get a badge printed out and put up to put it on my wall. This is to help you out, put the link in and then we reiterate, it’s only three questions that are all multiple choice. And you can fill it out in under a minute. All of those things that we’re seeing in there about it’s all about them, it’s to help them, it involves them just clicking three multiple choice questions, it’s under a minute, I mean, you’re gonna see a lot more people click on that link to go and check it out. Because this entire thing is about them. So it’s literally two or three questions. This is the important thing about the survey. It’s two or three questions. They are all multiple choice. They’re all actionable and useful questions. A lot of people, when we see people surveys, they come to us for advice. If you say, how many of these questions do you actually do that? Do something with the answer to? If the answer is Oh, we can’t do anything with it. typical example. Imagine you own Roberto’s Italian restaurant. Okay, and you ask them, What did you think of the style of, of the cuisine here? And they go, I hate it. I wish it was Indian food. I don’t like Italian, you’re not going to open up? You’re not going to start serving curry, you’re just not going to do it. People know that people do the same thing with location. What do you think of the location of our of our premises? Are you planning on moving? No, don’t ask the question. We have a philosophy that we call clicking, not thinking, the moment you put an open box. In a in a, in a survey, we ask people to type, you’re asking them to engage their brain, you’re asking them to stop thinking and start typing. And the minute you do that people think lots of think about that, and I’ll come back to it later, as we all know, later is never late as never. So we talk about clicking, not thinking. So if you just present a bunch of options, and I can mindlessly on my mobile, just click, click, click Submit, I know that I’m not going to have to engage too much brainpower because I don’t really want to fill out your survey, but it’s only gonna take you three clicks, it’s gonna be really quick, it’s gonna benefit me, that’s really, really useful.
Robert Temple 32:50
What’s interesting, as well as the clicking, not thinking philosophy powers, the idea that everything becomes actionable and useful. So if I get 1000 people to fill out my survey, and one of the questions is, how can I best help you right now, and what’s your biggest problem right now, if I give them an open text box, and they can just type 300 words of whatever they like, that takes a lot of work, I mean, sure, you could generate a word cloud, or you could like really spend some time analysing it’s not very, it’s not particularly easy to do, to try and pull anything useful out of it, and then work out who to show what to, whereas if I just summarise the top four or five things that I could help people with, and I put those as buttons, bearing in mind, if I don’t help you with it, there’s no point in giving the option to see it. So, you know, if we help you to do email marketing, and we said, What’s the biggest problem in your marketing right now? And you reply and say, Well, I’m trying to get me I’m trying to get my my Facebook chat bots to work, we don’t help you with that. So that’s a complete waste of your time and our time filling that out. So if we just give you the options we help you with to do with different elements of email marketing, then suddenly, we can help you with all of those, which means that we can definitely, and you wouldn’t be on our list if you didn’t have a problem with some of them. So we will definitely be able to help you in some regard. So definitely, we’ve we’ve said two or three questions, let’s talk a little bit about the type of questions that you’re actually going to ask we have a framework for Actually, this is dead simple to implement. So the first question is something to do with who or what are you? So to go back to Emma, our social media client, her example of that would be are you an entrepreneur looking to do better social media marketing? Is it your job within a bigger company? Are you a freelancer? Or are you an agency? Those are her four options? Because those are really the four types of people she generally serves. So who will What are you? Now if you were to look at our business, we would say something like, are you in econ? Do you sell courses? Are you an offline business? Are you some sort of service provider? Because those are the four people who would tend to find them with themselves onto our list? So which of those four things are you and then somebody can choose that option? The second one is once you pick challenge right now, what are you struggling with? Or how can we help you right now, so we might say our options might be I’m having problems getting my open rate, keep my open rate high and getting low, click through rates, getting high unsubscribe rates, I’m struggling to turn subscribers into customers. All of those things are very different challenges. Likewise, we’ve got some people who say, I can’t get my list to grow. And other people are saying, I’ve got a massive list, but I can’t get those people to buy anything. Again, coming back to that old thing we said earlier on in the presentation, we can’t talk to those people in the same way. So we have to know who falls into which camp.
Yeah, and the number two, just to let you know, is that’s about moving, getting a whip helping people get away from their pain point. That’s the point of it, and just realise a lot of times flying, we’re gonna have to pick up the pace.
Robert Temple 35:33
We do. And then the third one is, What’s your goal? Like? Where do you want to be? Are you you know, if we, if we were teaching how to build an online e commerce business, we want to know, are you just looking to make an extra couple of 1000 pounds or dollars a month to help you retirement? Or are you looking to build the next Amazon? Why are you having to build the next billion trillion potentially dollar company? What What’s your goal? So that’s all about helping them get towards their transformation? Where do they want to be? Let’s give you a quick example of this. If you’re in the fitness industry, one really important piece of information to know if you just join our list and we teach fitness is what age bracket Do you fall into? Because if you’re 18 to 24, we’re going to be able to teach you very different stuff, if you’re 65 plus, so that would be an example what age bracket Do you fall into? Because again, that’s important to know. Next one might be what’s your primary fitness goal, because again, if you are looking to lose 200 pounds, that’s very different from somebody who’s looking to train for the Great North Run, or the London Marathon. So again, we need to if we don’t know what your goal is, and where you’re looking to be, we can’t help you with with that stuff. And finally, here’s the third example, would be what’s your biggest obstacle right now? Is it mindset because you can’t get the motivation? Is it nutrition? You don’t know what to eat? Is it exercise because you don’t know what to do? Or is it you know, you’re a busy working parent, and you don’t know, you just can’t find the time for fitness. So again, so we have that matrix information, then we can see,
exactly, so let’s look at how it works in a practical sense, with it with another lovely diagram courtesy of Rob. So literally, they join our list by buying something or by joining your list. And they go through the survey with a bunch of four emails. And then immediately after completing the survey, you tag them or put them on different lists. And then you put them straight into the most relevant follow up sequence. So the people who say I’m interested in thing a goes into the sequence that offers them and helps them solve problem a, and the same with B, C, and D. So they’re now doing this is that this is a vertical email marketing that we talked about earlier on. So it’s allowing you surveys to actually power the insight you have on your customers, and then solve their problems much much quicker. By using the self elected insight. They’re giving you not scary, weird, artificial intelligence spying on you, am I five Voodoo?
Robert Temple 37:57
So I mean, to put this into a sort of a real context, when somebody comes into our business, and they opt in, and they go through our survey, we now find out basically how big their list is, if they have one at all, what their biggest problem with email marketing is, those are the two things we primarily want to know. And basically from the the two questions I’ve just outlined, there we are, we are able to know what the best thing to offer them is. So some people will need our email marketers game plan, which is like a collection of done for you email campaigns, they can just take and use. Some people, if they say I haven’t got a list yet, there’s, there’s less point in Australia sell that to them, some people will still buy it. But if somebody says I haven’t got an email list, the best thing we can offer them is a course about this building. Okay, great. Let’s help get your first 5000 subscribers in, we’ve got a course for that. So let’s sell them that. Now if somebody is further down the road, maybe they’re doing email marketing, but they’re having problems, one of our next best things we could sell them would be response, we our survey platform that does all the stuff we’re teaching. And then if somebody’s like, so in a different part of their journey, and we know actually, they’re gonna need some more nurturing first, then we’ll just make sure we tell them about our podcast, that Email Marketing Show. So that’s the sort of real life example of what goes on in order to get people who just come into our world, they’ve just heard about us to being a customer as quickly as possible. And likewise, being a repeat customer, if they’ve already bought one thing. Our next goal is obviously to nudge them up that ladder to become a repeat customer.
So what does all of this mean, Robert?
Robert Temple 39:26
Basically, it means that with you can build this entire thing out in a couple of hours, because it’s only four emails, a survey that you can drag and drop together. And the emails you’re already using to sell the products and services that you’ve got, and then just reorganised. So one of the things people say is they always sounds like lots of emails, and so it is but it’s the same number of emails you’re currently sending. It’s just rather than sending them one like stacked after the other like we’ve talked about with a horizontal email marketing, we just put them one on top of the other so they all go out simultaneously. So you can set the whole thing up in a couple of hours. The Tech is very good. with stuff like this These days, and then you can run it to your audience this week, and start getting better results, because off the back of it, your subscribers love you more. Because as Kennedy said before, it’s not in a sort of scary Big brother is watching you, you know, you talk about something and suddenly you start seeing ads for it sort of thing that actually freaks out the general public. And this is the information opposite is the opposite. That is the information your subscribers are volunteering to give you. They’re literally saying, This is what I want you to know about me now and do what helped me Help me as best as you can with the information that I’m giving you. And that does just lead to you getting sales faster, that first sale faster. But also, it means that you get to your repeat fast sales faster than ever. And you know what, not only does it get you that initial first sale faster, but it means every time you log into your email inbox, it’s your email platform to send an email, you can pull up just the segment of people that this message is perfect for, and just send it to them. And what that means is that your engagement from your list is higher than you’ve ever known it and it stays that way forever, because people are only seeing stuff that is highly highly and totally relevant to them.
Exactly, exactly. So it’s literally you’ve got that higher engagement, is it that’s what it’s about. So the whole summary of this is ask more questions, sell more stuff, don’t try and guess don’t try read their mind. You got to be a hypnotist or a mind reader. Ask what they want. What are you happy to, for us to talk about what your big challenge, these are the ways we solve it and getting straight into doing that as quickly as possible. That’s it. So, um, we did sort of fly through the end of that in order to bring this event back on time. So hopefully, that works out. Okay for everybody. So anybody have any questions? Based on what we raised? They’re
Robert Temple 41:46
just gonna jump out of full screen mode so I can see everything.
Paul has a nice point, which is seems to be a theme of recipient first and don’t make them think. Absolutely. We’re all busy. We’re all busy. And we’ve got different priorities, which isn’t, which is just good. Nick Crawford, email one and three as a peak is interesting. Yeah. So email number one, and number three seem to be the ones that we tend to make more sales I get most engagement from, obviously, that means you have to do number email, email number two in order to get a number three. But you know, it’s that sort of the way it is. But is there a plateau and max number of remainders before some before response stops? It’s interesting when we only ever do four emails, because we feel like after that it’s sort of getting to a point of like, Alright, we get it, if that makes sense. And Sergio was asking.
Robert Temple 42:45
Yeah, so it’s interesting. We aim. So for people who there’s two answers to this for people who click on to the survey, we always aim for an 80 to 85% completion rate, which when you when I say those words, everybody either thinks that’s Bs, or they think them. Yeah, wow, that’s incredible. Because if you think about the if you think about what we think of as average completion rates or surveys, when you’re looking at 39 questions to a page and a million pages, that’s, that’s unheard of, you know, getting 10% completion rate is good. So in terms of in terms of the type of surveys that we’re talking about, and the reason why response we exist, and why we do what we do, I mean, like any survey platform, you could build a survey in response to this as long winded as you want it to be with as many questions as you want. But we’re just recommending that this is the best practice. So we aim for 80 to 85% completion rate from the people who click realistically out of everybody in your list, if you could get half of your list segmented, that’s sort of like a pretty respectable place to be. So you can’t get 100% of it. Just being honest, you can’t get 100% of your list to go through this process. But generally, bearing in mind, it’s the first thing that people come across when they first come into your business. So it’s, you’re sending this out, when the engagement from each individual subscriber is at its highest. So getting getting people in so that you end up with about half of the list segment is more or less where we aim to be.
And more questions from folks on this. Did you find that valuable? Did you find that something you could go and implement pretty quickly, hopefully. So a new way of thinking about surveys were hope. Or not silence. That’s what we’re getting? Excellent. This is a listen to podcast. A really great quick win. Says roof sounds good. I’m gonna try that.
Robert Temple 44:38
Myself. Janine. That’s good. What’s nice about it is it is it is a quick win and implementing it once will impact everything forever. So like what we’ve what we really try and teach this as is a tiny little shift in the way that you do email marketing, but it has this like seismic shift in the results that you get and the impact that it has.
Yeah, and Not to just put this in once you want this to be in there for every single person who comes into your business. So this once you build it once and when it should exist unless you do want to drop it in, we call it the alpha email we call the alpha survey, which is the first thing that happens when someone joins the business. Keeping the surveys really simple, really resonates. Sounds good. Thanks, Paul. Appreciate it. If anybody does want to connect with with us, I’m on LinkedIn, I’m all over it, you’ll find my profile linked in my profile here on there.
Robert Temple 45:32
And if you just follow us on social media, I didn’t put the handle on the thing we’re probably most active apart from LinkedIn on on Instagram. It’s just Rob and Kennedy, Rob and Kennedy on Instagram, we post stupid stuff in the stories and have a laugh and interesting things. Kennedy’s quote of the day, which is currently on his whiteboard gets posted on it
for the day, by the way, is do more of what you’re good at. You go, boom. Awesome. Well, I think I think that’s and I think, observations or anything like that. It’s been really lovely. And again, everyone’s been saying that but massive thanks to Natalie and Andrew for making this event virtual and the show must go on and stuff like that. Rob and I speak at a lot of events. It’s a major channel for us and we’re seeing a lot of this happening so well done for supporting it. And but if I look at the technology exists for this to happen, so we can do all this stuff. So great stuff and go and use surveys properly please, for God’s sake, your new service probably. Alright.
Robert Temple 46:34
Take care folks enjoy the rest of the event.
Thanks a lot. Thanks